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I've heard of Jolly Rancher beer. Just pop a sweet into each bottle for a different flavour to suit your mood. I think I saw it in relation to flavouring an apple lambic.

&amp;quot;Adeptus&amp;quot;:1962zprq wrote: Sure what is a style other than a human construct designed to pigeonhole beers? <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt="" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->[/quote:1962zprq]
Sometime ICB member patto1ro said the other day[/url:1962zprq] that a beer style is "a consensus between brewer and drinker, a shorthand to describe the essential features of a beer and its relative alcoholic strength". I quite like that, and if you, as a brewer, couldn't give a flying one about getting consensual with your drinker, then I think you should give up on nomenclature altogether. It would make tasting sessions like last Thursday a bit more chaotic, though.

I don't see much harm in adding various flavours to beer that is brewed using decent grain in the first place. I'd be more concerned with beer that has a high degree of adjunct just for the sake of saving a few quid. Quality beer with intersting addition is fine with me. Just look at the Dogfish Head brews; they're all malt but with countless interesting spices and such.

As for adding cloves to get the Weisse flavour, I don't think that'll work too well because while the clove aroma is supposed to be there I think it is more phenolic than clove and the aroma from fresh cloves will not match. Weisse beer yeast, unlike all other brewing yeast can breakdown ferrulic acid and this gives the distinctive phenolic aroma. I think that fermentation control is the best way to get the required flavours in a Weisse. Cloves just smell so bloody strong. I imagine it'll come out like a herbal beer of some description.

Excellent <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt="" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D -->

I guess I'm a Trotskyite, mainly because I agree with Peter Bouckaert of the New Belgium Brewing Company, and it seems to tie in with the constant revolution idea.

Have a listent to this Basic Brewing podcast[/url:2a501kbg] where they have a tour of the New Belgium brewery and chat with him (skip to 8:55 to get straight to him). He might be a little over-dramatic and comes accross a bit weird at the start ("we make art, 10 minutes of pleasure, not a style") but there ya go, he explains it better over the interview <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt="" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D -->

Also here[/url:2a501kbg] where he has fun with Charlie Papazian (skip to 15 mins in to get straight to him speaking to a brewers group). He hates the BJCP Stalinists <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt="" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> An entertaining listen.

I think the consensus is still there as long as you're not hiding anything.

If you brew a beer and say "I know this doesn't conform to the style I was aiming for but I didn't give a damn because I was feeling experimental/mad/foolish/lazy/drunk so I threw some cloves in. I guess this isn't a weissbier anymore but it tastes bloody good/bloody terrible". (this is the consensus building part but I suppose you would need a big label)

On the other hand if I brew a weissbier and throw cloves and banana flavouring in and say nothing then this consensus no longer exists.

&amp;quot;Hendrixcat&amp;quot;:3n7l0q7x wrote: As for adding cloves to get the Weisse flavour, I don't think that'll work too well because while the clove aroma is supposed to be there I think it is more phenolic than clove and the aroma from fresh cloves will not match. Weisse beer yeast, unlike all other brewing yeast can breakdown ferrulic acid and this gives the distinctive phenolic aroma. I think that fermentation control is the best way to get the required flavours in a Weisse. Cloves just smell so bloody strong. I imagine it'll come out like a herbal beer of some description.[/quote:3n7l0q7x]

Thanks. that's kind of what I was wondering. Apart from the whole 'ethical' discussion, if you just end up with crappy beer it's a bit of a moot point.