TOPIC:

"TheBeerNut":vmpxn55f wrote: But I was thinking more about your better class of off licence, where a bottle of Irish craft beer will cost you about €2.60-€2.80. A decent German import is about the same. Now, a can of Heineken or Guinness, or some of the cheaper German and Polish imports come in at €2.00-€2.15, which isn't cheap, and this is where I'd like to see the Irish beer pitched.[/quote:vmpxn55f]I think you're still underestimating the costs involved in getting that beer on the shelves, if you're selling a bottle of beer for €2.00, you're probably just about selling at cost. The excise duty reduction is a boon for the brewers alright, but it's not a panacea that'll make Irish beer widely available and at reasonable prices. There are far more barriers to entry in the market than the high excise duty.

Brand loyalty, yes, but it stems from the fact that the average pub has the same few beers/brands.
For every time I've had that conversation with someone I've also had a conversation along the lines of 'I went there before, They didn't have "X" but I tried their own 'version', and it was lovely'. Trouble is, I have this conversation with people, while sitting in my local, back with the usual limited choice.

Coming from outside of the two biggest cities, going to the likes of the Porterhouse or the Well is something of a novelty.

&amp;quot;TheBeerNut&amp;quot;:39i50a96 wrote: Well, I for one don't throw a knicker-fit and sit pouting in the corner spoiling everyone else's evening if I'm not presented with a craft beer option.[/quote:39i50a96] Yeah but thats cos you're an open minded individual willing to try new things - wine, water, cola, orange juice, coffee... <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt="" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D -->

&amp;quot;Poc&amp;quot;:nv6en7cd wrote: I think you're still underestimating the costs involved in getting that beer on the shelves[/quote:nv6en7cd]
Well yeah, I'm not saying that the Irish craft brewing industry are a shower of rip-off merchants taking the piss with their over-inflated prices for what is, let's face it, basically water. I suspect that, given the overheads and no economy of scale, it's a miracle that they can even compete at the €2.70 mark. I guess what I'm asking for is the excise situation amended to allow Irish brewers to compete in domestic off-sales rather than simply survive, which seems to be where it's at today.

&amp;quot;Ichiban&amp;quot;:hwet708w wrote: I wouldn't separate the prices of food and beer however. Just one price with a 'wink-wink' and a generous fingers-up at the Revenue...[/quote:hwet708w]

I'm not sure they will let you away with that. I would imagine that the excise man will take the view that you are packaging the beer with the food, as a single menu item, therefore you are selling the beer, so here is your bill for excise duty.

I'm sure you could make the argument that this is not the case, but customs and excise will say yes it is, now pay the bill. You then have to either go to court about it, or pay the bill.

Why not simply sell the food and the beer separately, at reasonable prices and let the microbrewery excise rebate help you out?

&amp;quot;TheBeerNut&amp;quot;:hwet708w wrote:

&amp;quot;sbillings&amp;quot;:hwet708w wrote: maybe give a deal when you buy them together[/quote:hwet708w]
I think that would be illegal: drink must be sold at the same price all day.[/quote:hwet708w]

Ok, so you keep the beer the same price, but discount the food when you buy a beer with it.

&amp;quot;sbillings&amp;quot;:1226dr3c wrote:

&amp;quot;Ichiban&amp;quot;:1226dr3c wrote: I wouldn't separate the prices of food and beer however. Just one price with a 'wink-wink' and a generous fingers-up at the Revenue...[/quote:1226dr3c]

I'm not sure they will let you away with that. I would imagine that the excise man will take the view that you are packaging the beer with the food, as a single menu item, therefore you are selling the beer, so here is your bill for excise duty.
[/quote:1226dr3c]

Your venture then implies having a beer license to sell beer on the premises. These licenses are more expensive than wine licenses and might be the deciding factor in going into business at all. The "backbreaker" of a start-up cost!!

Taking what you said on board about the view of the ExciseMan, you could [u:1226dr3c]offer[/u:1226dr3c] a free beer with the dish, to be accepted or declined by the customer. Basic human curiousity would indicate that they would accept and drink, even just a sip...
If they like the beer and think the price of the food (i.e. the "total" bill) is acceptable, they'll be back. If they love the beer, they'll bring their friends. That is the hope of course....