TOPIC:

I'm goin to sit on the fence on this one a bit, I can see both sides of the argument here.
I think the removal of all price promotion on alcohol is a bit draconian.
I do feel though that the cynical promotion of below cost alcohol in bulk as a means to drive footfall into your supermarket/store is wrong. Bulk discounts on macro brands and the below cost selling of spirits has been the main focus of promotional activity of the big supermarkets since the removal of the groceries order. Alcohol is now cheaper then it was 20 years ago whereas groceries are not.
It is unsustainable, and from a 'supporting craft beer' perspective it makes craft beer more difficult to sell as people perceive the cost of production to be much lower then it actually is. It makes it very difficult for craft beer producers to compete, and ultimately will lead to less choice as to where alcohol is purchased and what products are offered for sale as the supermarkets squeeze out the independent trade.
I know, that for instance during the month of December the off licence departments in some of the supermarkets were running on a margin of -12 to -13%, nobody can compete with that.
Whilst in general I do not support laws that control markets, I do feel that at least the below cost selling of alcohol as the intoxicating carrot to drive people into your store and the arguable subsidisation of this practice by the VAT system is wrong.

"drinkstore Stoneybatter":15r2enqa wrote: the cynical promotion of below cost alcohol in bulk as a means to drive footfall into your supermarket/store is wrong.[/quote:15r2enqa]I don't see where the line between "cynical" and "smart business" is drawn. Surely all business is cynical to some extent: every business wants customers' money.

"drinkstore Stoneybatter":15r2enqa wrote: Alcohol is now cheaper then it was 20 years ago[/quote:15r2enqa]Things getting cheaper is a good thing. Consumers don't like it when things get more expensive.

"drinkstore Stoneybatter":15r2enqa wrote: from a 'supporting craft beer' perspective it makes craft beer more difficult to sell as people perceive the cost of production to be much lower then it actually is.[/quote:15r2enqa]Then we need to work on that perception. I'll bet they don't have the same perception when it comes to Mateus Rosé vs. Amarone, or Paddy vs. Connemara Single Cask. If they can't see the difference between Leann Folláin and Carlsberg then [i:15r2enqa]that's[/i:15r2enqa] where the work is to be done. The supermarkets are making it easier to show this contrast by discounting the macro brands.

"drinkstore Stoneybatter":15r2enqa wrote: It makes it very difficult for craft beer producers to compete[/quote:15r2enqa]It makes it more challenging. Introducing legislation which hits all consumers in order help craft brewers compete is cracking a walnut with a sledgehammer. And to claim a public health justification for doing so, as some in the drinks industry are doing, is very cynical. IMO.

We have more or less (slightly more, I think) the same number of breweries in the Republic today as we did five years ago when the Groceries Order was abolished.

"drinkstore Stoneybatter":15r2enqa wrote: nobody can compete with that.[/quote:15r2enqa]So stop trying. Offer things that supermarkets can't offer. Bring in trade that supermarkets won't get. It's the same deal with the pubs and the off licences: if the former stopped seeing the latter as a price competitor and concentrated instead on offering things that off licences can't, and charged accordingly for them, everyone would win.

The idea that supermarkets, independent off licences and pubs are all in the same business is just nuts, IMO.

[quote:gr5ho6xk]The idea that supermarkets, independent off licences and pubs are all in the same business is just nuts, IMO.[/quote:gr5ho6xk]

Ya, but to think one can't (some times in a big way) affect the other is just nuts

That's true. The trick is to try and minimise that effect by doing things as differently as possible. The approach of the Intoxicating Liquor Act 2008 seems to be about forcing one to do business the way another does at (literally) the consumer's expense.

"TheBeerNut":1528vhbg wrote: The idea that supermarkets, independent off licences and pubs are all in the same business is just nuts, IMO.[/quote:1528vhbg]


This is a very good point. There were a few letters in the IT a while ago where people were asking if there were any pubs with real fires that didn't have massive TV screens showing Sky News or sports at full volume.

I'd much rather sit in a nice pub with a pint of O'Haras rather than sitting at home with a bottle.

And by the same token there are people who'd rather watch the football on a giant screen in a crowded pub than at home. The atmosphere is part of the product.