TOPIC:

This is a question that I can never decide on,when does a golden ale stop being a golden ale and become an ipa.I know that it is hops that decide this but is there a ibu no or is it just what the brewer decides. <!-- s:!: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt="" title="Exclamation" /><!-- s:!: -->

I thought golden ales were from a different "family" (Munich malt added to give them that golden color); IPAs would be more bitter, hoppier, and higher gravity/abv versions of normal pale ales and would get the sweetness and color from Crystal vs. Munich.

I'll probably have the style police (or style discussion police) run me down for this, but the BJCP guidelines are one place to get guidance on Pale Ale vs. IPA.

If we look at the new BJCP Guidelines for IPAs (Category 14), they're broken down into English IPA (14a), American IPA (14b), and Imperial IPA (A.K.A. "double IPA") (14c). [url:2nqen2j9]http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style14.php[/url:2nqen2j9]

And then for Pale Ales we now have two separate categories, one for American Pale Ale and one for English Pale Ales; Category 10 "American Ale", which includes "American Pale Ale", "American Amber Ale", and "American Brown Ale". [url:2nqen2j9]http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style10.php[/url:2nqen2j9]

And Category 8 for "English Pale Ales", which includes "Standard/Ordinary Bitter", "Special/Best/Premium Bitter", & "Extra Special/Strong Bigger (English Pale Ale)".
[url:2nqen2j9]http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style08.php[/url:2nqen2j9]

So if you're talking about American Pale Ales vs. American IPAs we're looking at:

[b:2nqen2j9]American Pale Ale:[/b:2nqen2j9]
OG: 1.045- 1.060
FG: 1.010 - 1.015
ABV: 4.5% - 6.2%

IBUs: 30-45
SRM: 5-14

[b:2nqen2j9]American IPA[/b:2nqen2j9]
OG: 1.056 - 1.075
FG: 1.010 - 1.018
ABV: 5.5% - 7.5%

IBUs: 40-70
SRM: 6-15

So according to BJCP, the main statistical difference between American Pale Ales and IPAs is the difference in Gravity/ABV on the bottom and top-ends, and the IBUs but obviously there is some overlap. -You should also read through the style descriptions for an understanding of the qualitative differences.

[b:2nqen2j9]English Pale Ale[/b:2nqen2j9]
OG: 1.048 - 1.060
FG: 1.010 - 1.016
ABV: 4.6 - 6.2%

IBUs: 30 - 50
SRM: 6 - 18

[b:2nqen2j9]English IPA[/b:2nqen2j9]
OG: 1.050 - 1.075
FG: 1.010 - 1.018
ABV: 5 - 7.5%

IBU: 40 - 60
SRM: 8 - 14


So... According to the BJCP Guidelines, it's the same basic difference between an English Pale Ale and an English IPA (IPA= higher ABV and more IBUs).

Having said that this is an organization with quite an American slant so take it with a grain of salt, especially for non-American styles. (I'm yet to see an English IPA even remotely close to 7.5%, myself... and if Marston's Old Empire has 40 IBUs I'll be very suprised; it's hop aroma is EXTREMELY light, too.)

I DO, however find most of the QUALITATIVE information on the BJCP site pretty good most of the time.

-Read the taste difference between an American and an English IPA; malt differences, fermentation-derived flavor differences (American Pale Ale doesn't have any), water profile differences, and of course American vs. English hop profiles.



I'm just the messenger trying to answer the question you asked; please don't shoot me!

Adam

&amp;quot;DEMPSEY&amp;quot;:ui60u51v wrote: This is a question that I can never decide on,when does a golden ale stop being a golden ale and become an ipa.I know that it is hops that decide this but is there a ibu no or is it just what the brewer decides. <!-- s:!: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt="" title="Exclamation" /><!-- s:!: -->[/quote:ui60u51v]It's just what the brewer (or his marketing people) decides.

I can't think of many golden IPAs but they do exist. BrewDog Punk is one. Mostly it would be down to the bitterness level and your own opinion (or your marketing people's) of where the beer turns from one to the other.

Interesting that the BJCP doesn't seem to have any conception of British Golden Ale like Fuller's Discovery or our own Weaver's Gold. BeerAdvocate has decided they're bitters while RateBeer seems to have a broad "Golden Ale/Blond Ale" covering all sorts of things.

A style debate! Run!! Hide!!! Save the children!!!

I realised after the posting the above that with Weaver's Gold, Belfast Blonde, Ór and Helvick Gold, Blonde Ale represents a sizeable proportion of Irish beer. Since no-one else has claimed it, maybe we should say it was one of ours all along: Irish Blonde Ale.

I'll write to my bezzy mates in the BJCP.

I'm Not going to wade in on the 'classification' debate but I will say I tried [b:2tdnenqm]Greene King's Sun Dance[/b:2tdnenqm] over the Christmas. It bills itself as a 'Golden Ale'.

Have to say it was delicious and would be perfect for a Summer tipple, much nicer than a cold 'lager' which a lot of folk reckon is the ultimate for a sunny day.

My English friends don't have a lot of time for Greene King products however, they are a becoming a bit of a monolith in UK brewing hoovering up other breweries and brands.

If you get to try it though do, I'm a covert to Golden Ales now.